Wednesday, April 14, 2010

Say NO to Common Bar Exam

My dear friends,

Common Bar Exam (hereinafter referred as CBE) is 'to be' imposed.

How much do u know about CBE?

Why some people are so concern about CBE???

This is due to the fact that this CBE will replace the current Certified Legal Practice (exam) which is currently only restricted to those who pursue their LLB in private institutions. The rationale why CLP is not invoked on public universities students is that pursuing LLB in public uni requires 4 years to complete but only 3 years in private. This additional 1 year in Public uni we learn professional subjects like Criminal & Civil Procedure Code, Ethic and etc.

In Malaysia, we have only around 15 law schools inclusive of Public uni and private colleges. The reason of requiring the graduates from private colleges to undergo CLP is to equip them with Malaysian Legal knowledge on account of they learn nothing about Malaysian Law along their 3 years LLB.

For Local Uni, we are learning Malaysian Legal System, we don't answer common law in exam for most of the subjects coz we are taught with Malaysian Law, we apply Malaysian cases. 4 years of exposure to Malaysian Law is far more enough than 1 year of CLP.

As far as we concern, there's no problem with CLP until this was raised by private institution in the year of 2000 and further proposed by Dato' Ambiga in 2006 who was the President of Bar Council at that juncture. The fact is that to pass CLP, it is undeniable not easy and due to that they have no choice but to spend a few hundred thousands to pursue their Bar at overseas (Lincolns Inn / Middle Temple/ Inner Temple etc.) in order to allow them to become legitimate lawyers.

Sudah tentu, there's no problem for those who are Kaya. How about for those who can't really afford; what to do??? Oppose CLP and propose a uniform exam for all regardless where he/ she studies.

For me, they are being too selfish! Why?

1st: to pursue law in private institution is not hard at all as compared to public uni provided u Kaya!

2: they don't require u to have 10As or 3.6 above to pursue LLB, 4 credits dalam SPM cukup laa; Again Janji Ada Duit!!!

3. Private institutions are not selective when it comes to admission coz the best candidates are admitted to public uni.

4. They can't afford to choose sebab kalau nak pilih, semua x layak; kalo x terima sape nak bayar gaji pensyarah & kerani itu pasal they select everyone Janji Ada Duit???

5. Private institutions graduates can't put at par with us because everyone knows to pursue Law in local universities u must be really GOOD; not only academic wise but also your curriculum.

6. We don't need CBE to produce capable & eligible lawyers as 4 years LLB in public uni are more than sufficient for us to know and faham Malaysian Law as compared to CLP which u learn Malaysian Law not even 1 year.

From this, it is clear cut that the problem is with Private institutions and has nothing to do with UKM, UM, UIAM, UiTM, UUM, UDM, USIM *correct me kalau ade yang tertinggal. This is not about 'tolerance', this isn't about Right To Be Heard.

I give u an analogy, when u know someone steals your handphone *Blackberry (hahaha. Sajer...) and he then asked u to give it to him, are u going to compromise and give away ur thousands of ringgit to him just because of he tells u he can't afford Blackberry??? Can he claimed he has right to express? Please la. Fuck off (sorry, m abit harsh) Don't deprive our right and further claim u r upholding your right 'so called equality'.

Halo, when I have nothing to with this problem, don't come and pull me in this trouble; this is your trouble in your colleges ok! Damn!!! Friends, I would only agree to have CBE provided Private institution practice our system of admission meaning to say, only pick the best! Not only that, they teach Malaysian law for four years, just like what we practise! If u think u r learning foreign law is so good, by all means don't kacau us!!! We say NO to Common Bar Exam.

Voices of Public Uni Law Graduates

By JR Tey
Universiti Kebangsaan Malaysia

29 comments:

  1. I must say that I have no objections to the CBE, or CLP to be limited to overseas law graduates only, for the simple fact that the curriculum in public law school makes the imposition of CBE/CLP on their graduates redundant and a waste of time.

    I however disagree with your generalisation that law students from private law school is where they are today because they could afford to pay the expensive fees imposed by private law school. Your "Janji ada duit" stance, I must say is an insult to many law students from private colleges who are under scholarship like myself and many of my course mates. It is also an insult to many other law students in our college who is under loan, and who has to work part time or full time to pay for their fees.

    Granted, there are those in our college who are purely there because they parents could afford to pay for their fees, and they could barely pass their A-Levels, let alone graduate with honours in LLB. But for many of us, we work as hard, if not more than students from public universities to graduate. Your generalisation is especially offensive to them.

    As law students, we must be objective and matured in our discourses. We must be able to weigh what may or may not contribute to the whole objective of the discussion. Hitting below the belt, definitely is not.

    Again I stress, I see the merits of your case in excluding CBE from being imposed on public uni students, but not in relation to the callous judgment that graduates from private/overseas law school is inferior to those from public universities.

    Regards.

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    1. Very well said. Totally in agreement with you.

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    2. Very well said. Totally in agreement with you.

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    3. Very well said. Totally in agreement with you.

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  2. its a disgrace that your generalisation of private college students are so narrow..well,for the best of your knowledge, i am from a private institution and just completed my finals..i am doing an External programme from UNIVERSITY OF LONDON..may i say this that they are one of the leading law schools in the WORLD..wonder whats the current ranking of our beloved public universities?haven't they go out of the top 200?
    i have nothing against the public university graduates but an article like this do press all the wrong buttons in me..sorry if u found me being harsh but the fact is that if you can call yourself as the best candidate or public university graduates are the best,there should not be a reason to oppose a qualifying exam that takes into consideration all law graduates and create a level playing ground..end of the day,it is better to have more competent lawyers out there than depending on the duration of study whether 3 or 4 years..that should not be the tie breaker..as it stands,private college graduates are at a disadvantageous point..that is regardless whether YOU agree or not my friend!

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  3. Your article makes me proud for NOT studying in public university because you have just confirmed my suspicion that the 'products' of public univeristies (I hope there are few exceptions)are such an ignorant, self-righteous, arrogant and plainly rude idiots. Congratulations, not only you have offended us the private law school students, you have also undermined the reputation of the public universities. Sorry I'm a bit harsh but I think there's no harm for a person of such thought like you to use some harshness, you deserve it.

    I look forward to the possibilty of both of us meeting at the court :)

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  4. To my dear JR,

    You are such a disgrace.

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  5. Disregarding the obvious prejudice you have towards students in private institutions, it is easy to doubt your capability and capacity as a law student, given your countless grammatical errors,unfounded accusations,and flawed logic.
    If you purport to represent all public university students, please at least demonstrate some skill in argumentative writing and the use of English.

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  6. Stupid arguement! You better learn from your law school on how to reason well!

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  7. Dear Mr. JR.

    Some of the comments here are so hostile toward your defend against imposing CBE and CBC.

    Don't worry my friend, many others are supporting you in this regard.

    I'm a fresh graduate of LL.B (Hons) from Universiti Sultan Zainal Abidin (UniSZA).

    A PUBLIC UNIVERSITY! (fully run by public fund - the so-called DUIT RAKYAT)

    However, until today, our LL.B program has not been recognized by the LPQB (still pending), so we can't practice as Advocates and Solicitors.

    We are also NOT ALLOWED to sit for CLP either. Literally hopeless state of affairs!

    There are 4 BATCHES that have completed their LL.B program. Meaning, they already passed their final exams leading to the granting of LL.B (Honours) degree. (3 batches already successfully went through the graduation ceremony, whereas 1 batch still pending)

    But I never give up on this. Thus, I have created a new blog here: http://llb-unisza.blogspot.com/

    Feel free to visit!

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  8. Hey there. For your information, we at MMU (Multimedia University) have CLP exemption and we study 4 years of degree like you. Not only that, our syllabus are similar to yours as most of it are based on Malaysian authorities (cases and statutes). Please do a research before generalising and belittling those from private universities.

    PS: I was not accepted by the public universities which led me to pursue it privately. So don't judge unless you know our stories.

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  9. please work on your grammar before posting up such 'heavy' post.

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    1. My thoughts exactly! The above was too painful to read. Considering that, in his view, one needs to obtain 10As, I wonder how his 1A in English came about.

      In the event JR is overtly sensitive that he needs to waste yet another year to do the CBE, why not just have the CBE as it is, ie everyone has to take that exam without spending a year to study for it - akin to taking IELTS, you do not necessarily have to go for classes before the exam. Just do the exam! And get the 10As in in which he has obtained before his enrollment into university

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  10. Those who are graduated from public university is the best? I beg to differ. Some people that are graduated from the public university don't even know the basic law. You managed to entered the public university is because you are nerd enough.

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  13. Nothing but pure ignorance and lack of research. I do understand why you're opposing CBE because having to sit for another exam after struggling for 4 years to obtain an LLB is something that I would not be prepared to accept as easily either, but what does it have to do anything with us, the students from private institutions? To pursue Law in private institutions is not hard at all? Like seriously? Now a simple 1% research into the universities ranking that we graduate from would have given you the information you need. Of course it is easy for us to pursue law as long as we have "4 credits dalam SPM" but boy, it is never as easy to graduate! Isn't graduating from law school more important than being accepted in one? Is that how literally you could take a word after all those law essays you wrote along the way? Plus, Bar is not easy to pass either and the only reason private institutions Law graduates opt for Bar is because they are granted with the ability to practice in any commonwealth countries when they want to just in case.
    P/S Your blackberry example doesn't make any sense!

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  15. I agree with the point that local Uni graduates should not be implicated by the CBE integration process. The fact that it is redundant has sufficient merits.

    However, to deliver this point was it necessary for you to offend us private Uni graduates ? Your comments on 'janji ada duit' implies that we can just buy our way through private Uni. To say this, I assume you must have done some sort of survey, interview or you would have read our law syllabus and observed our exam questions and marking scheme? No? I didn't think so. Do remember that we have to work as hard as you to graduate too.

    You say that only the cream of the crop gets into public Uni. Do you know that there are also top STPM scorers that do not get into their desired marketable Uni courses every year, which is why, the private Unis are in place to supplement and mitigate this shortcoming? Have you heard of scholarships and loans? The fact that you generalize shows that you failed to even realise these obvious points.

    Also, your English, with terrible grammar and pseudo-Malay cum Chinese accent. Is it that hard to write an article with proper English, especially when you are advocating your case? Last but not least, your painfully weak Blackberry example shows that you lack argumentative and persuasive skills.

    All in all, you present your case biased, with lack of research, lack of authority, and with laughable grammar. Yet you stand in public discourse claiming to be the cream of the crop while labelling us inferior. Yes CBE would be redundant for you. That is true. However I doubt that your fellow local Uni comrades would stand with you for delivering this point in such a rude and childish manner.

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  16. So fickle minded. I'm from a private uni and I'm doing great so far. Heck, most of my colleagues are too. The fact that you can think of it and flaunt it in your blog shows how shallow your mindset is. It is full of rubbish. Nuffsaid.

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  17. So fickle minded. I'm from a private uni and I'm doing great so far. Heck, most of my colleagues are too. The fact that you can think of it and flaunt it in your blog shows how shallow your mindset is. It is full of rubbish. Nuffsaid.

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  18. What rubbish, private institutions may be easy to get in but not easy to stay on. Use relevant facts and information to base your argument not on the basis of discriminating other people. And who says that only students who have minimal grades are the one who enrol in private instituions? Do you know how many straight A's students, 7,6,5 A's students that enrol in private institutions? There are many. Its not if we are rich we can study at private institutions, many students survive on schorlarships provided by the private institutions which the public institution could not have provided them with in the first.
    Anf on top of that, we private institution students are competing alongside foreign students instead of just malaysian students. Don't you see how much we have to rise up too to be able to compete with them. The way you are voicing your argument seems like you are saying that Malaysia public institution students are so damm smart better even than foreign students (UK, US and so others) and even including us. Please, don't be so proud until you have to discriminate other students. Think before you say anything. If you want to argue a point by all means go ahead but don't discriminate people to try to prove your point. It does not help, but it goes to show how you as a public institution student mentality is which is so narrow minded as compared with us private institution students.

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    1. Sorry for the spelling errors, too angry to double check what I wrote

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  19. err brother? FREEDOM of speech? Malaysian constitution? UN charter? ECHR?
    why lah delete comment. BN ban words, u also want to ban comment ah? best.

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  21. I am more than surprised to hear your blatant generalisations over IPTS student (for myself am one), although not myself coming from legal studies background.

    I now have a string of wild imaginations of your mental capacity and what do you do in university (minding this an old article), or should there be a stark disagreement between what they chose to teach, and what you chose to learn.

    Learn to coexist man, are you really sure there are no other reasons that led to entrance to IPTS?

    IPTS performing no better, you churned your own statistics and studies?

    What is your MUET score by the way.

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  22. Cut all craps short, if you think you are as qualified as, or even better than any foreign law graduate to sit for and pass CLP, then kindly prove it to us. After all, CLP should be more than cakewalk for you who have studied Malaysian law so thoroughly for 4 years.

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